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 Peak:  Longs Peak  -  14,255 feet
 Post Date:  01/23/2013 Modified: 01/26/2013
 Date Climbed:   01/19/2013
 Posted By:  bergsteigen
 Additional Members:   USAKeller, Stone_man, sdkeil, moon stalker, letsgocu, kushrocks

 Longs North Face / Cables Route     

Longs Peak



Mileage: 12.54
Elevation Gain: 5,154'
Route: North Face / Cables Route
Time: 16:20
Beta: Dancesatmoonrise TR & Mountain Project

All good trips start out full of promise and expectations. We were excited for the possibility of climbing the Cables Route in January during a low snow year. The photos/beta looked great, we discussed gear and racks and meeting times, etc. A plethora of emails were exchanged in the week leading up to the climb. Then the night before came and somehow we had to get some sleep, despite how excited we all were. We knew it would be a long day. 7 people on a climb like this, will take a while, a long while.

3am came quickly. I readied my gear, boiled my water, made hot cocoa and coffee, got in my car and started driving to the rendezvous point... hmm where exactly is it? Since our group was coming from all over Denver and Boulder, it was decided to meet in North Boulder, at the Bustop Gentleman's Club. Yep. Thankfully it's a long running joke in Boulder, so I knew roughly where it was on Broadway, but not exactly. Here's some beta: typing "Bus stop" into iPhone maps feature in Boulder will not get you to the Bustop (one s). As the night was still young, for some, the place was still hopping. It felt weird to be hanging out in the parking lot, waiting for the rest of the crew to show up, dressed in climbing gear, and discussing nuts and ice screws... Too many jokes, too little time!


The guys discussing their racks, outside the Bustop... guess who chose this meetup location?! Not I!


Once finally at the trail head, gear was divided up, and we started up the well packed trail (microspikes are useful). Ryan set a blistering pace and eventually we had to have Shawn set a more humane one. Since otherwise, we'd all be down to base-layers in a few more miles! Oh the exposure! The miles ticked by and we found the Rocky Mountain rescue short-cut, to get rid of one annoying switchback. Once beyond that, we were above treeline, and we could see the glowing lights of the Front Range below. The sun quickly followed us up, and I ran to get a good vantage point of the Diamond for sunrise.

Image #1: Sunrise on the Diamond

Sunrise on the DiamondView Larger Image


Image #2: The team coming up the trail, sunrise behind

The team coming up the trail, sunrise behindView Larger Image



I remember the trail up to the boulder field being long, but the good company made the time go by quickly, maybe a bit too much so! We took a nice break below the pass, as we knew it would get windy once above it. Above the pass, the approach just kept going, it seemed like the peak wasn't getting much closer. Eventually as we got closer to the route, we could see a group of 3 in the middle of the climb. They were making good progress, so we wouldn't have to wait on them.

Image #3: The Mummies

The MummiesView Larger Image


Image #4: Ahhh, Longs North Face!

Ahhh, Longs North Face!View Larger Image


Image #5: Still more boulder field to go...

Still more boulder field to go...View Larger Image


Image #6: Brian Crim's crew on the route

Brian Crim's crew on the routeView Larger Image



The apron below the route has a bit of snow, and during the climb up, I kinda wish I had my axe or crampons on, but it is doable without. For the last push up to the belay station, some did get out the spikes and points, since the snow was pretty hard packed. I certainly didn't want to fall here!

Image #7: Shawn coming up the slope

Shawn coming up the slopeView Larger Image


Image #8: Kyle and Joe traversing the snow to the base of the climb

Kyle and Joe traversing the snow to the base of the climbView Larger Image


Image #9: The fun class 4 crack to the base of the climb

The fun class 4 crack to the base of the climbView Larger Image


Image #10: Looking back down the approach

Looking back down the approachView Larger Image



Image #11: Kelly using her tools to come up the rock

Kelly using her tools to come up the rockView Larger Image



There is a nice ledge to the west of the belay station, that served as our gearing up zone. Joe got ready quickly and headed over to the base, to build the anchor. As he was starting up the route, the group of 3 we had seen before, showed up. Thankfully from our ledge, we could communicate with them, that there was a climber on the way up. They waited until Joe got to the top and then rapped down to get out of our way. It turned out it was BrianC! Small world on the Cables Route today.

Image #12: The gals in silhouette

The gals in silhouetteView Larger Image


Image #13: Joe leading the route

Joe leading the routeView Larger Image


Image #14: Joe just past the first crux

Joe just past the first cruxView Larger Image


Image #15: Joe using his ice tool, guess there is some ice!

Joe using his ice tool, guess there is some ice!View Larger Image



With one rope up, Shawn followed on Kyle's bright orange new rope, and unclipped as he went. Then Kyle did a sport climb to bring up Joe's old crappy rope for the rest of us to abuse with ascenders. Standing there waiting for Kyle to climb up, my toes got rather cold as I was belaying. So I had to shake them as best as possible to keep them from freezing, since I would not have that opportunity while climbing. I then got the task to clean the route of gear, to finalize the fixed rope. I'm glad that my climbing mentors have had me second them so much, so I've had plenty of practice taking gear out. Thanks Bethany and Ben (ie B(3))!!!

Up to this point, I had never done any aid climbing, so my ascender was new, and while I understand the physics of how it works, I wasn't quite about to trust it completely. (Yes I did test my weight at the start) So I treated the climb like a lead one, and used my mantra of "don't fall", that I use while climbing in general. Yes, I know, falling is a part of this sport, and it can make you a better lead climber. Well, I'll fall another day, in a "safer" environment! It made the climb a bit more difficult with this mindset, but it also showed that I could lead this pitch, eventually (and definitely with experienced partner(s)). I'm not there yet, I have a lot more learning to go before I would feel confident to lead a group. Since knowledge and skills do not equate to experience. In that, I feel I know just enough to be dangerous, and I need to be careful in what I am willing to do. There are plenty of situations I have not seen, and in that I need to be aware of my own knowledge gaps. All that is needed is time and more learning experiences.

There is some ice along the route, which requires an ice tool and crampons, but not enough to be an easy ice climb. Plenty of places where you have to "spread your legs and trust your points". I found that it was too difficult to remove gear with my mittens on, and had to remove them each time. I wish I had brought my ice climbing gloves, as my liners were not enough to keep me warm, my hands were frozen by the top. I also need to work on removing gear with my left hand, as I had to constantly remove my leash from my axed right hand to get gear out. When I got to the top of the route I noticed a bit of a twinge in my right wrist, like I had banged it against a rock and bruised it. Now I know that I managed to inflame the tendons (hopefully minor), as there is swelling without bruising. I think over gripping my axe without the leash for support, may be what injured my right forearm.

The rest of the crew used their ascenders on the fixed rope to get to the top. One of these days, I'll have to try this aid climbing thing again. Maybe it will go smoother when it's not so bloody cold! With 7 people on the rope/climb, it took a long time to complete, and we all went as fast as we could, but not fast enough to stay warm in the shade and wind. I felt bad for the team of 3 who had to wait on us to get up the route. Especially when we later learned that it was Jim, the guy who holds the record for ascents on Longs, with 399 on this day! May # 400 be much faster!

Image #16: At the belay station

At the belay stationView Larger Image


Image #17: Shawn seconding Joe, taking up the first rope

Shawn seconding Joe, taking up the first ropeView Larger Image


Image #18: Kyle lead sport climbing, taking up the second old rope - Photo Credit: Caroline

Kyle lead sport climbing, taking up the second old rope - Photo Credit: CarolineView Larger Image


Image #19: Me belaying Kyle - Photo Credit: Caroline

Me belaying Kyle - Photo Credit: CarolineView Larger Image


Image #20: Me using my beloved Grivel Rambo ice tool, cleaning the route - Photo Credit: Caroline

Me using my beloved Grivel Rambo ice tool, cleaning the route - Photo Credit: CarolineView Larger Image


Image #21: The first crux, and first bolt

The first crux, and first boltView Larger Image


Image #22: Some ice, mostly friable crap to send down on your team/belayer. Beware!

Some ice, mostly friable crap to send down on your team/belayer. Beware!View Larger Image


Image #23: Ryan follwing me up, on ascender

Ryan follwing me up, on ascenderView Larger Image


Image #24: A view down the face

A view down the faceView Larger Image



Once above the top anchor, the route to the summit is mostly snow free, otherwise barely ankle deep. It was nice to get to the summit where my feet could finally warm up in the sun. I really hate getting screaming barfies in my toes, but they don't make boots my size, and I didn't want to hike in my clunker size and half too big Koflach's! I may have to look into getting some of those fancy battery operated toe warmers that Kelly has. She had warm feet, I did not.

Image #25: The route up the remainder of the face

The route up the remainder of the faceView Larger Image



The view from the North Face of Longs

We hung out on the summit for only a short time, as it was getting really late, and we all were exhausted. Longs just seems to have a way of taking it out of you! We snapped some pics of Jim's 399'th ascent, and headed down.

Image #26: Pano to the north

Pano to the northView Larger Image



Jim had set up a rap above our anchor, and so we graciously utilized it to get down the snowy steep section above our rap station. Since it was a very thin rope, I did a backup fireman on Caroline's first ever rap. It definitely contrasted with the next rap, as Joe's rope was almost too big for the alpine ATC I had brought. I had to forcibly shove the rope through the device to get down to the base. At least I knew I wasn't going anywhere! Though I did another light fireman on Caroline, just in case.

Image #27: Ryan on the rap

Ryan on the rapView Larger Image


Image #28: Me rappelling - Photo Credit: Caroline

Me rappelling - Photo Credit: CarolineView Larger Image


Image #29: Caroline on rappel

Caroline on rappelView Larger Image


Image #30: Caroline rappelling

Caroline rappellingView Larger Image



Shadow of Longs behind Ryan

Sunset from up high

Jaw dropping exposure by the Diamond

The sun set as we took off our points and got out the microspikes again. It was quite beautiful to have watched sunset from so high up on Longs. Unfortunately the price you then pay, is going through the boulder field in the dark. Thankfully the moon rose and lit up the rest of our descent below granite pass. Finding our short cut route proved a bit time consuming, and taking the trail may have been faster than the wallowing we ended up doing. Once back on the trail it was a peaceful moonlit stroll through the trees, to get back to the trail head incredibly late. A very long day on Longs, but a fulfilling one for most!


My GPS Tracks/Waypoints on Google Maps (made from a .GPX file upload):
Map data ©2013 Google - Terms of Use
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Thumbnails for uploaded photos (click to open slideshow):
Image #1: Sunrise on the Diamond Image #2: The team coming up the trail, sunrise behind Image #3: The Mummies Image #4: Ahhh, Longs North Face! Image #5: Still more boulder field to go... Image #6: Brian Crim's crew on the route Image #7: Shawn coming up the slope Image #8: Kyle and Joe traversing the snow to the base of the climb Image #9: The fun class 4 crack to the base of the climb Image #10: Looking back down the approach Image #11: Kelly using her tools to come up the rock Image #12: The gals in silhouette Image #13: Joe leading the route Image #14: Joe just past the first crux Image #15: Joe using his ice tool, guess there is some ice! Image #16: At the belay station Image #17: Shawn seconding Joe, taking up the first rope Image #18: Kyle lead sport climbing, taking up the second old rope - Photo Credit: Caroline Image #19: Me belaying Kyle - Photo Credit: Caroline Image #20: Me using my beloved Grivel Rambo ice tool, cleaning the route - Photo Credit: Caroline Image #21: The first crux, and first bolt Image #22: Some ice, mostly friable crap to send down on your team/belayer. Beware! Image #23: Ryan follwing me up, on ascender Image #24: A view down the face Image #25: The route up the remainder of the face Image #26: Pano to the north Image #27: Ryan on the rap Image #28: Me rappelling - Photo Credit: Caroline Image #29: Caroline on rappel Image #30: Caroline rappelling
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  • Comments or Questions (42)
I Man


Way Cool!     2013-01-23 13:52:45
Nice to see the team out and about on a fun and challenging route!

It was great to run into you guys on Huron...hopefully it will happen again. You guys will be in good shape if you keep this training schedule up Smile

Thanks for writing, O!


dillonsarnelli



oooooh man     2013-01-23 14:10:37
what a crew! AWESOME job gang.


nkan02


sixteen hours???     2013-01-23 14:35:30
in winter? Ouch. I would have been frozen solid. You are probably ready for Denali now Smile


SurfNTurf


Sweet     2013-01-23 14:41:32
I'm just going to go ahead and assume the night concluded with lap dances at the Bustop. Nice work to Otina and the Denali crew. The photos and descriptions of the route are some of the best out there -- invaluable beta. Thanks, Otina!


MtnHub


Super job, people!     2013-01-23 15:30:33
... and beautiful photography as usual, Otina! Yes, a LONG(s) day for sure. Thanks for posting! Very Happy


jmc5040


Awesome Work     2013-01-23 16:11:50
I was waiting for someone to put a TR together on this climb, thanks Otina. Awesome work to the entire crew!


Brian C


Good to see you all!     2013-01-23 16:52:45
It's a small world out there! Glad that you all made it and nice work getting such a large group up and down safely.

”All that is needed is time and more learning experiences.”
Too bad there aren't more people out there such a humble attitude! You have way more experience than many others that I've seen out in the hills. As Harvey Carter once said, ”The more 'good fights' a climber has had, the richer he becomes.”

Great report!


LynnKH


nice!     2013-01-23 17:14:03
Congrats and thanks for sharing - love the pictures!


Taillon75



Sweet.     2013-01-23 18:01:10
Great TR worth posting. How long was that rappell?


MountainMedic


Hot Damn     2013-01-23 18:06:47
Great report and awesome climb. Looks like you've got a great team dynamic for Denali!


sdkeil


Rappel length     2013-01-23 18:22:18
From the top of the technical climb to the bottom of technical climb we used a 60m double rope rappel. That does not include the short class 3/4 section above the technical section, which Otina talked about us rapping on a single line that the other group provided nor does it get you down the class 3/4 section leading up to the technical section. We down climbed that off rope. There was maybe 5m to spare for the rappel.


BostonBD


Incredible trip report and photos     2013-01-23 19:27:13
Great job by the whole crew. The last 3 photos are masterpieces. Thanks for sharing the journey. 5 stars!


Taillon75



Thanks.     2013-01-23 20:23:55
Good info. What did you use for anchor on rappel? Retrievable or a Fixed?


sdkeil


Eye bolt     2013-01-23 20:57:16
We used one of the old ”Cable's Route” eye bolts. We ran the rope through and were able to pull it down after the rappel.


TomPierce


Good stuff     2013-01-23 21:06:44
Enjoyed the report and insightful comments. Good job to you and the team. Hard to imagine Jim D is still at it, I've crossed paths with him over the years. Great report!
-Tom


Mindy


Great TR....     2013-01-24 09:36:01
As always Otina, you reports are very useful and the pictures are fantastic.

Congratulations everyone!


bergsteigen


Thanks everyone!     2013-01-24 14:10:09
I'm glad our crew could get some more beta for future trips! It's the main reason I put this up, so soon after Dances' TR.

SurfNTurf - You may assume, but you may not be correct! Have fun when you take this route!

Brian C - Thanks, I guess I've just heard too many stories of accidents happening with newer climbers, that I want to be conscious of all those tiny mistakes that can happen. That, and I have a 'healthy' fear of heights. Embarassed I'm happy to take the slow journeyman approach to climbing.


Brian C


The slow approach...     2013-01-24 14:40:20
...is the way to go. It took me years to push up my level into technical stuff. I learn new things all the time. Like I said, it's too bad more people don't have that approach. Climb on!


lordhelmut


Gentlemen's Club     2013-01-24 15:53:59
Always a fine location for a pre-dawn meetup. Just in time for the Ladies Open Stage night.


Bean



Junkshow     2013-01-24 17:55:50
I'll go ahead and be Captain Buzzkill.

7 people, including beginners and slow people, in winter, on the north face of Longs is a terrible idea. If you have to jug up that route, you probably shouldn't be there.

That poor Rambo..


Bean



...     2013-01-24 18:27:59
The north face of Longs isn't hard. I maintain that if you have to jug up it, you shouldn't be there.

How long were you holding up the other party for?


bergsteigen


Training...     2013-01-24 19:34:53
Bean - Certainly, 7 is not ideal. But 7 are going to Denali (I'm not one of them). Guessing 2 rope teams. The temperatures and difficulties we saw on Sat, will be nothing of what they will experience in Alaska. From my winter mountaineering experiences up there, a team that doesn't climb hard things together and work through communication and other technical issues, is not going to have much success.

And yes, poor Rambo got scratched. Wish there was more ice!

I believe that jugging was utilized to speed up the climb by so many, and as a backup. I think everyone there could have climbed it in a traditional TR manner.

It took us about 3 hours from when we got to the base to the top. So my guess is we held them up for 1-1.5 hours, since they arrived when about half our group was already on top. But that's the risk you take when you are on a popular route. We had to wait for Brian's group to rap down, so that also took a little time as well.


Monster5


Dude     2013-01-24 19:54:44
If a party makes it up and down a route safely, they've got plenty of right to be there. The resources they decide to utilize in order to do so safely are completely up to them. If somebody doesn't feel safe skiing down Capitol and decides to side step the entire thing to stay safe, that's entirely up to them too.

If a party down lower has to wait, it's their fault for not waking up early enough on a popular route and their prerogative to air the grievances, not yours.


d_baker


hahaha,,,,,     2013-01-24 20:23:37
^ that's too funny! score!

EDIT: ps, congrats to the group on Longs!


Bean



”Dude”     2013-01-25 05:55:41
I didn't say anything about the ”right” to be there. I mean what I said, and I said what I mean; words have meaning, so don't mix and match words to fit the story you've told yourself and then attribute them to me.

Someone not comfortable skiing Capitol - or Quandary for that matter - shouldn't be there on skis. That also assumes that anyone (aside from J. White) is actually comfortable descending that mountain on skis.

I would not call the north face of Longs in January a ”popular route,” even in summer being held up for an hour and a half there would be ridiculous. When I did it there were several groups on the face and crossing paths at the rap and no hold ups.


bergsteigen


Patient group     2013-01-25 09:44:13
Bean, I'm glad that we didn't run into an inpatient group then, since Jim's team was very good natured, friendly, and seemed more concerned that we did everything safely, than our speed (which really wasn't all that slow). I had a nice talk with Lisa, their lead climber, while our groups were rapping the route. She started the route next to the cables, but didn't bring enough gear. I guess that's what happens when you do this route so many times, you only bring what you need!

Natalie - There was NO ice being kicked on the belayer. It was noted for future groups. Nothing like huge rocks coming down gullies in summer...


nkan02


I tend to agree with Bean     2013-01-25 09:53:03
The main takeaway from the Dances report (at least to me) was that a party larger than 3 probably should not be on that route in winter. The risk is hypothermia. We were a party of two, moving pretty quickly and I was COLD. I was very thankful we did not have 3rd person (as when we did the route in summer, which was fine) to worry about.
I am disappointed to see that an experienced climber like Otina (and the crew) decided to go in such a big group. You would have enjoyed the climb much, much more if you split your group in 2-3 smaller ones. You would have cut down time you've spent on a mountain by a third or more.

p.s. Feel bad for the other party too that was held up by your group.
p.p.s. Kicking ice on your belayer? I did not think there was enough ice to begin with. ouch. Very gaper report, sorry.

EDIT: I was referring to the footnote in Image #22: ”Some ice, mostly friable crap to send down on your team/belayer. Beware!”
Glad to hear that at least you did not make that mistake.


CarpeDM


Congrats!     2013-01-25 11:03:13
I agree with Brian that it's nice to see humility in your report. You acknowledge that there is room for improvement, but the ability to see that should be the starting point for everyone in the hills. Good luck to the Denali crew.


semitrueskerm


Uff-tah     2013-01-25 11:12:34
Shhheeeit! I am not even worthy enough to read...


Brian C


Why all the criticism?     2013-01-25 12:20:08
I really don't see anything wrong with heading out in a group to try and push limits as long as it's in safe manner. I see people ”guiding” people in Eldo often when they are belaying incorrectly on a multi-pitch routes or belaying off of very poor anchors. Very different than having several more experienced members leading those with less experience under a watchful eye. It is common in the summer to see trip reports go by where people make potentially life-threatening decisions (i.e. heading up into a storm, overestimation of ability, epics) and nobody says anything negative to them. I just don't quite understand why Bean and Natalie chose this one to openly criticize. I agree that a party of 7 is a bit much and I raised an eyebrow when I saw them heading up behind us, but I am not in a position to chastise them about it. Am I missing something?


bergsteigen


No snow blues?     2013-01-25 12:51:52
Not sure why all the criticism either, as I've certainly read my fair share of bad TR's where the person didn't even realize how dangerous they were being, dropping packs/Avy gear during the climb/ski etc. But I'm glad I've gone through far worse criticism during my PhD prelim/Comp exams! Laughing Maybe my humility was seen as an opening for attack.

The reality is this: I wrote the report as beta for future climbs (which I knew would be happening soon by friends). I pointed out some issues that I had, or that I noted, so that future groups would #1 think about group size, speed, gear etc, as well as #2 not make the same mistakes (like having better boots/gloves for climbing)

Our group was prepared for the wait. Had their ”Denali” puffies at the ready. We were safe, didn't do anything that we weren't prepared to do. Sure, it was a learning experience. But unless you're on par with Steve Gladbach, I don't think there are many in this community that can truly be without criticism of themselves either. We all need to look in the mirror and realize we don't know everything.


Bean



Because...     2013-01-25 13:04:57
...haters gonna hate.

More specifically, two dozen comments gushing about how amazing and awesome a group of 7 spending an entire day jugging up the 5.easy N Face of Longs is was too much for me to look past.


KeithK


Nice job, my friends.     2013-01-25 14:19:50
Otina, you have my respect and admiration, and you need not defend yourself to ANYONE on this site. Between the 7 of you, there is an unbelievable amount of experience, competence and good judgement. Congrats on tackling that route and getting it done safely.


semitrueskerm


Ditto     2013-01-25 16:30:20
Ditto Keith's comments. Again, I am in awe.


hansolo35

frizzle fry!!     2013-01-25 18:10:59
cant do anything about the naysayers Otina...this was a great report and sounds like a good trip outing for ALL! photography is topnotch as well. its not up to others who weren't there or directly involved to judge who and who cant go have fun in the mountains, nor even define what fun is for each individual. Pay the naysayers no mind. Just keep on doing what you love and worry about yourself, not what a few negative nancies have to say about it.
enjoyable read!


Dancesatmoonrise


The one after image 10     2013-01-25 19:59:56
That's hot.

Oh, Kelly, nice tools! : )

Nice to see that Joe felt the need to protect this as well.

Don't fall? Consider the Kevin McLaughlin approach: ”Don't test the system!” Laughing

Yes, Otina, one needs to be extremely careful about injuries in the cold. It is so much easier to injure an extremity in a cold enironment.

Beautiful photodocumentation of the route. You succeeded where I failed. A personal thank you, as well as one on behalf of the climbing community!

Images 29 & 30: Our favorite badass girl does it all!

But wait, no moonlight descent shots??? : )

Thanks for sharing a fun trip and a great report!


BTW - we're all 14ists, Can't avoid politics. I'll weigh in. I'm proud of you guys, knowing the risks and inherent difficulties of trying to get seven folks through the bottleneck of a one-pitch alpine technical route, and getting it safely and successfully. My hat is off to all of you!


Monster5


Dude (2)     2013-01-25 22:03:13
You said: ”I maintain ... if you have to jug up it, you shouldn't be there.” I'm an engineer and I know what connotation is. You don't think they have the right to be there. A team that is preparing for Denali. A team with almost as many combined summits and high altitude experience as you have post counts. Dude. Now the ”have” part is questionable. Sounds to me like they did everybody a service by opting to jug up rather than wait for everybody to climb. They made it up. They made it down. Safely. Timely for their party. Done. Dude.

And then you said: ”I mean what I said, and I said what I mean; words have meaning, so don't mix and match words.” That's dumb. But cute. That's cute, Bean. Connotation. The words are the same. Bean.

But what's this? ”Two dozen comments gushing...” Is that what this is about, bro? Comments? Are you bummed yours (with the fantastic photography) only received 9 comments? That's sad. I feel for ya, dude. But that's not what it's about. I'm making that up, mate. People love your personality and would've commented on it if they could. But they were probably busy. Actually climbing something. Or biking something or cruisin' a 5.easy single-pitch iconic climb known to render waiting parties dizzy in anticipation, bro, since you can relate to that.

Now now, not a popular route, huh? Followed by ”when I did it there were several groups” (nice plug, btw). Not to mention a few groups when Otina was up there and at least two more I know of whom canceled since they anticipated a large number of people. And the three parties planning it when Nat's group did it. On a weekday. But I guess I'll give it to ya since quantifying ”popular” can get tricky.

”...EVEN in summer being held up for an hour and a half there would be ridiculous.” Well, Bean. Dude. Friend? It isn't summer. It is winter. Takes more time, y'know. That's the nature of winter hiking.

And the whole hypothermia safety risk? Really? They're preparing for freakin' Denali. I'm pretty sure they're prepared for a wee bit of cold.

Now, pointing out (nonexistant) ice falling on an icy route (as a slope stability guy, I've gotta say ice ain't exactly a stable material to begin with) and criticizing a prominent, helpful member for doing something safely as a group? Well, if that don't smack of the almighty ELITISM word bouncin' around, then I don't know what does. (Not that I don't respect you Nat)


Bean



LOL     2013-01-25 22:22:51
U mad


Monster5


no, bean     2013-01-25 22:46:55
We're friends.


nkan02


Ryan     2013-01-26 06:12:22
turned into a Monster... You know what? It seems like nobody on this forum can express a personal opinion without an angry pushback. As a non-skier, criticizing someone's ski style is a low blow. Bean skied the North Face if you didn't catch that part. And is entitled to his opinion. And so am I. And there is NO elitism. Just didn't see any helpfulness in stating the obvious.


d_baker


opinions     2013-01-26 06:46:31
If Bean is entitled to his opinion, and if nkan02 is entitled to her opinion, I guess that leaves no room for Monster5 to voice his opinion? That's not right.

We all have our opinions. And there have been a few ”angry pushbacks” coming from both sides.

But whatever we do, do NOT question the skiers and their ethics. Do NOT voice your opinion in opposition of a skier.

Ethics were questioned. When we question someone's ethics, we should look at our own as well. I'm NOT excluded from this statement.

I understand both sides of the argument in these comments. But, if the group of 7 decided to split into smaller groups, would there not still be a log jam waiting to get on the crux pitch?


Bean



whatevs     2013-01-26 06:47:02
I'll be the first to admit that I'm not a very good skier even in full-on alpine gear, and my poor form is exacerbated by light, soft gear.

Hard for me to say for sure, but it seems that an engineer should know better than to mix his personal internal narrative with facts and declaring the result factual. But since you're an engineer, maybe you would know better about that. Because you're an engineer.

Not that it particularly matters, but I did this route in June. As an engineer, I think you'd understand that climbing routes in CO are more popular in June than in January (ice climbing excepted).



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